[00:00:07] Welcome to the GrowOrtho Podcast. I am one of your hosts, Zach Dykes, joined by Dr. Bryce Gilliam, 2024's 40 Under 40, America's top young dentist, co-host of the TV show Making Modern, available on Macs, and owner and operator of Elevation Orthodontics, Dr. Bryce, welcome to the show.

[00:00:30] Thank you so much for having me, man. I'm excited to talk today.

[00:00:32] I am too, because guys, this is not just theory. I say this each and every episode. Dr. Bryce is in the trenches. He's doing the work. He's making the decisions. He's going out and killing it and dragging it home. Like he's making things happen here.

[00:00:47] So today's topic is marketing and growth, and this is a HIP podcast. That's one of our biggest things is marketing and growth. Dr. Bryce, how do you handle bad leads and preventing team overload?

[00:01:02] Bad leads. Bad leads, man. That's the thing that I hear often. Oh, I got a bunch of bad leads.

[00:01:07] So I think one thing with work with HIP, and this is not necessarily a, hey, work with HIP thing, but HIP does a really good job of teaching you that there are no such thing as bad leads.

[00:01:20] And I believe wholeheartedly in that there's no such a thing as bad leads. There's bad attitudes and there's leads that don't fit your patient population, but that doesn't mean that you can't gain something from it.

[00:01:33] And really what I mean by that is just take your mind and think about it in a different context, right?

[00:01:38] So you get a lead that gives you the opportunity to communicate with a patient.

[00:01:43] That gives you an opportunity to practice your skills as far as communicating with that patient.

[00:01:49] But then also it gives you the ability to touch your community.

[00:01:53] And what I say by that or what I mean by that is it gives you the ability to let someone feel welcomed to answer their questions, no matter if it's about ortho or if it's not.

[00:02:06] I mean, I've had people that will call me and literally they're talking about implants.

[00:02:10] And my team is trained to be so nice and so respectful and so helpful that they're like, oh, my gosh, I wish I had a tooth there to be moved.

[00:02:21] And what will happen is we've gotten referrals just off of that.

[00:02:25] So just change your mindset just a little bit and think there are no bad leads.

[00:02:30] I'm learning from this. I'm gaining something from this each time.

[00:02:33] Kind of hitting the second part of this. How do you help your team not feel overloaded?

[00:02:39] So I think it's really about putting the right people in the right roles.

[00:02:44] There's a lot of calls that you get throughout the day.

[00:02:47] And if you don't have the right people handling those calls, those calls can be overextended.

[00:02:53] Those calls can feel like they're a burden.

[00:02:56] But if you have the right people in place, they enjoy that communication.

[00:03:00] They enjoy being able to help people.

[00:03:03] And it doesn't feel like you're overwhelmed.

[00:03:06] Some people are people persons, you know, like they love they they feel energized by having conversations.

[00:03:13] Others are very organizational minded.

[00:03:16] They want, you know, I just want my numbers or I just want my task and like everything's in its place and all of that.

[00:03:22] And knowing where to put the right people in the right seats is so important because when you have that, it's like having a beautiful watch.

[00:03:32] If you took that watch and you move some of the gears, you shifted them around and everything.

[00:03:38] Would that watch work the same way?

[00:03:40] It probably wouldn't even work at all, to be honest.

[00:03:43] But that's the same thing with your practice.

[00:03:45] It's like if you know that Jill hates talking to people, you probably shouldn't have her as your front desk person.

[00:03:54] You know, you probably should.

[00:04:02] Overload it is to have a script.

[00:04:05] If you have a script that people can follow, that just gives them the appropriate and straightforward way to get to the solution, too.

[00:04:17] I think that that's one thing that we all talk about so often is having an initial call script or initial contact script.

[00:04:24] But if you can focus on that and kind of keep it at the forefront of your mind whenever they're answering those calls, it really helps navigate it in a smooth and consistent way.

[00:04:36] And then the other thing that I think is super important is you've got to have a good marketing partner.

[00:04:42] You guys are my marketing partner, so I'm a little biased.

[00:04:45] Hip is incredible.

[00:04:48] But you've got to have a marketing partner that you can lean on and say, hey, I need this type of client.

[00:04:55] I need you to help me find this one.

[00:04:58] We need to reach this particular patient population.

[00:05:02] And if they're good, they're going to be proactive.

[00:05:05] They're going to look at your ads.

[00:05:06] They're going to run ads for you that will actually get you the patients that you're looking for.

[00:05:11] Yeah, it's not just about stats.

[00:05:13] It's not just vanity metrics.

[00:05:15] My gosh, so many people are like, oh, well, you got this many impressions.

[00:05:19] It's like, well, did you start anybody?

[00:05:22] You know, you can show me all of these things, but did you get anybody in the door?

[00:05:27] That's a huge, huge part.

[00:05:29] And thank you for saying that because attracting the right clientele, I think, is so important with any kind of marketing effort.

[00:05:37] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:05:39] And I think that this is something for all those startup practices that are, you know, you don't have very many patients.

[00:05:45] You're sitting there twiddling your thumbs.

[00:05:47] This is a great time for you to sit down on paper, well, I guess computer, and define who your right client is.

[00:05:57] Who is the quote unquote right client?

[00:05:59] Who is the person that is your target audience?

[00:06:02] And make a profile.

[00:06:04] Give them a name.

[00:06:05] Call them Betty or Betsy or whatever you want to call them and say, this is who you're looking for.

[00:06:10] That way, whenever you do work with a marketing company, you can say, this is my target demographic.

[00:06:16] This is who I'm going after.

[00:06:17] So let's take that just a step further because some people might not know how to create an avatar, you know, to go after.

[00:06:25] Can you give me an example for Elevation Orthodontics?

[00:06:28] Who is your avatar?

[00:06:29] Ours is really, really in-depth.

[00:06:31] Ours is Betty.

[00:06:33] We have Betty and we have Brian.

[00:06:35] And, you know, I have a B name, so that's why I named them that.

[00:06:38] Betty is a 25 to 35-year-old young professional that has a little bit of a disposable income who goes and shops at Lululemon and Viore who will buy.

[00:06:56] She'll get Botox and she's well in health and wellness.

[00:07:02] And she may or may not have had orthodontic treatment in the past.

[00:07:08] If she's had orthodontic treatment, then she's probably got a little bit of relapse and she wants it to be touched up.

[00:07:14] But she's really focused on her aesthetics because she's wanting to, you know, she sees the benefits of that in life, social settings, her professional setting, and things like that.

[00:07:26] With your practice, you know, for the people that don't know, you're an adults-only practice.

[00:07:33] And knowing that, having that, you know, I want somebody that this is what they're going after.

[00:07:39] You're not saying, well, you know, we could have somebody that's seven years old that just, you know, hit the cusp of where they could get orthodontic treatment.

[00:07:48] Or we could have a 14-year-old that plays tuba or whatever.

[00:07:52] You know, like you've got all of these things.

[00:07:54] But if you actually take the time, and this does go into your marketing, because once you have your avatar, you need to see if your marketing partner can actually reach those people.

[00:08:07] That's right.

[00:08:08] And before I sign on with you guys, I had actually reached out and worked with a couple of other marketing firms.

[00:08:14] And everybody said that they could do it.

[00:08:18] Everyone said, oh, of course, we have that demographic.

[00:08:20] Oh, of course, we believe in your business model.

[00:08:22] Well, this is what you should do as a business owner working with a marketing company.

[00:08:28] You should ask them how.

[00:08:30] How are you going to reach that patient demographic?

[00:08:35] How are you going to reach that patient demographic?

[00:08:37] Sit back and let them tell you their strategy.

[00:08:39] Then when you look at their strategy, you want to look for things that are proactive.

[00:08:44] You want to see proactive stuff.

[00:08:46] You don't want to see a bunch of reactive stuff that happens six months after you've worked with them.

[00:08:52] Yes, it takes time to build a marketing plan.

[00:08:55] Yes, it takes time to build SEO.

[00:08:58] Yes, it takes time to build all those things.

[00:09:00] But you want someone who is in the trenches, in the weeds with you to help you get to your goal.

[00:09:07] Yeah, it's a partnership and not, you know, like it you're not just buying a Coke and getting a Coke.

[00:09:14] Like it is a hand-in-hand partnership.

[00:09:18] And I think a lot of people, you know, they've got this thought process around marketing.

[00:09:24] It's like you turn it on and it magically happens.

[00:09:28] And it would be so much nicer if it was that way.

[00:09:32] But it's so much more intricate because it takes you on, you know, the orthodontist side doing your job

[00:09:40] because you could be inundated with so many people that your team doesn't know.

[00:09:46] They're back to that overload.

[00:09:47] They don't know how to answer the phone calls because you didn't give them a script.

[00:09:51] They don't know how to do all of these things.

[00:09:55] But you have to be able and ready for that as well.

[00:09:59] Yep. And I think there's two more main things that I think is really important when you're trying to find that right client.

[00:10:07] And another thing that will help do that is for you to invest time into your community.

[00:10:15] I had to learn this the hard way.

[00:10:16] I thought that I could hire marketing companies.

[00:10:18] I thought that I could, you know, make awesome smiles and then that would be enough.

[00:10:23] But the reality is people really want to see you interact in the community.

[00:10:29] Once they know that you're a part of the community, once they know that you care about them more than just taking their money

[00:10:36] or making their smile beautiful, then things start to blossom so much more.

[00:10:41] I can't underestimate how important it is to be, you know, meeting with your other professionals,

[00:10:47] whether that's, you know, your dental professionals or your health care professionals.

[00:10:51] And then the same thing with just the patient population as well.

[00:10:56] You want to make sure that you are showing face to things that they care about as well.

[00:11:01] Knowing that, you know, like say I was running the same type of practice as you are,

[00:11:07] but I'm in a small rural town, that's going to be way harder because I'm assuming my people are going to be exactly like that.

[00:11:17] They're buying Lululemon when it might be, I need to broaden my scope a little bit more.

[00:11:23] You're absolutely right.

[00:11:24] I mean, if you're in a rural area, your patient demographics can be so much different from mine being in the middle of the city.

[00:11:29] But the cool thing is you get to play to the highlights of your audience, right?

[00:11:35] And so maybe it is a hometown thing.

[00:11:37] Maybe you just have to go to the hometown grocery store or the hometown church.

[00:11:41] And then that just is all you need, which is really good.

[00:11:45] So make sure that you're aware of your surroundings.

[00:11:48] Make sure you're investing in your community and you'll be perfectly fine.

[00:11:52] And I think that goes into branding as well, like finding what fits you,

[00:11:56] but also what is going to bring the right kind of attention to your practice in your city or town.

[00:12:04] Yeah. Consistency with branding is really important.

[00:12:08] The thing about branding is it's hard to kind of quantify.

[00:12:12] It's more of one of those things that you just have to consistently be whatever you are going to be, right?

[00:12:19] So when I say that, it's funny because it kind of doesn't make sense or it's really vague.

[00:12:23] But when you can look at the outline of a logo, you know that that company has done a good job.

[00:12:29] If you can identify that outline of a logo and say that's Coke or that's Pepsi, right?

[00:12:35] Or if you even see a color and you think of that company, they've done a really good job with branding.

[00:12:42] And it's the same thing.

[00:12:43] So you want to have consistent marketing.

[00:12:45] You want to have consistent colors.

[00:12:46] You want to have consistent even experiences.

[00:12:49] Every time it should feel the same where you can submit your brand into that client and into that potential referral source.

[00:12:57] I love Apple.

[00:12:59] I'm huge into their ecosystem.

[00:13:01] Every time you get an Apple product, it doesn't matter if it's their AirPods, a MacBook, a phone, everything comes in the same type of box.

[00:13:11] It feels the same to pull the little tab and do all of these things.

[00:13:16] And everything just works together.

[00:13:17] And that's how you want your branding.

[00:13:19] It might not be the same logo.

[00:13:22] Of course, it wouldn't be illegal to do that.

[00:13:25] But you want your brand to feel like you.

[00:13:28] Goes back to that.

[00:13:29] You can't fake that.

[00:13:31] Let's talk about some strategies to increase business from starts into just getting patients in there.

[00:13:39] Because it is a challenging economy and I feel like it's only going to get more challenging.

[00:13:45] What are some strategies that you have done in your practice?

[00:13:49] The goal is to be successful no matter what the economic climate is.

[00:13:54] And sometimes it's easier said than done.

[00:13:56] And some areas are easier than others.

[00:13:59] Like, for instance, if you're seeing a lot of kids and things like that, people take care of kids, right?

[00:14:06] In my patient population, we really get affected by the ebbs and flows of the economy because, you know, we're more of a luxury brand.

[00:14:15] And so we want to be successful no matter what's going on outside these walls.

[00:14:20] And the thing that I want to make sure I'd say is you have to offer flexible payment options.

[00:14:27] And that doesn't mean that you have to give them a discount.

[00:14:30] That doesn't mean that you have to, you know, have super low fees.

[00:14:34] What that's saying is that you have to make it affordable, right?

[00:14:38] And affordable is basically what is it per month.

[00:14:42] You could have a $10,000 note.

[00:14:46] But if you're paying $10 a month, no one's going to bet an eye.

[00:14:52] And so that's the thing.

[00:14:53] So you want to make sure that you offer programs or financial options that are affordable to them and meets them where they are.

[00:15:01] You know, I know some people are like, well, if I, you know, extend my payment plans past their treatment time, they're not going to pay afterwards.

[00:15:10] Well, the people, like it's statistically shown, if they're going to stop paying, they're going to do it early and they're going to disappear.

[00:15:17] So many more people will, if you make it where it's like, oh, it's $189 a month or whatever.

[00:15:23] Man, that's way easier than $500 a month.

[00:15:26] Those are the people that are going to disappear.

[00:15:28] That's right.

[00:15:29] And to be honest with you, it's scary as an orthodontist to take that approach.

[00:15:36] It's scary because you know how you can get burned.

[00:15:40] But just like Zach said, the statistics show that if they're going to default or not pay you, it's going to happen earlier than later.

[00:15:49] And so I think that you can kind of rest assured that it will be okay.

[00:15:52] And believe me, I'm talking from experience.

[00:15:54] I felt the exact same way.

[00:15:56] But as you get into this mindset, kind of tweak your mindset just a little bit, it seems to become a little bit easier.

[00:16:03] You start to see success and you start to see that you don't get burned as much as you think you will.

[00:16:08] And then you can start so many more cases.

[00:16:11] And again, the economy is less of a factor.

[00:16:14] Another strategy that you can use is emphasizing value over the price.

[00:16:20] Yeah.

[00:16:21] Anytime that you can talk about how valuable this is or when I say value, I'm not talking about value in a monetary form.

[00:16:29] I'm talking about like what will this do to your life?

[00:16:33] How will changing your smile change the trajectory of your life?

[00:16:38] And it can do that.

[00:16:39] It can help you professionally.

[00:16:41] It can help you socially.

[00:16:41] It can help you in so many ways just have that self-confidence to do something bigger than you ever would have.

[00:16:48] Price is made up.

[00:16:50] Let's just be honest.

[00:16:51] It's whatever, you know, you make it up.

[00:16:54] You've got your, you know, your P&L, what this is going to cost and all of that.

[00:16:58] But you're going to make up that price.

[00:17:00] But if somebody's thirsty and they haven't had water, well, this water is $3.

[00:17:08] But the value of this water to someone that's dying of thirst is priceless.

[00:17:14] You're exactly right.

[00:17:15] You're exactly right.

[00:17:17] And I think that that's something you just have to, you have to build that value in it.

[00:17:21] I mean, you know, like I said, if I go in and I say, oh, yeah, here's Invisalign.

[00:17:27] Invisalign is going to do the job and Invisalign is $10,000.

[00:17:30] They're going to be like, okay, well, I don't see the value there.

[00:17:36] And that's why you had a lot of people go into the DIY type of clear liners is because they didn't see the value.

[00:17:42] Because we as orthodontists, we as businesses didn't share and show the value.

[00:17:49] And so I'm a big fan of making sure that they understand what they're getting from us and what they can expect from us.

[00:17:57] And I think the next layer is making things convenient.

[00:18:01] People will pay for convenience.

[00:18:03] That's why Amazon is absolutely crushing.

[00:18:06] People spend so much money with DoorDash.

[00:18:09] And so convenience is so important in this day and age.

[00:18:13] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:18:14] And if you're going to put your feet in the sand or draw that line in the sand, whatever the saying is,

[00:18:20] and say that I'm only going to work during these times and this is all we're going to do,

[00:18:25] it really limits your patient population and your case acceptance.

[00:18:29] And what we've done is we've tried to become the most convenient option that they possibly can have.

[00:18:35] We will literally work around patients' schedules.

[00:18:38] We will try to make it work as much as we possibly can within limits.

[00:18:42] You know, I mean, of course, there's always going to be those outliers.

[00:18:45] But we treat currently, we treat about 50 patients that don't even live in our state.

[00:18:50] And so the idea behind that is, listen, if you start treatment with us, we'll see you through to the end.

[00:18:58] And we'll make this work for your busy lifestyle.

[00:19:01] I love that because people want convenience.

[00:19:03] They want that.

[00:19:05] And when you are willing to meet them where they're at, not just financially, but with their lifestyle and what they've got going on,

[00:19:14] makes so, so big of an impact on them.

[00:19:19] I agree.

[00:19:19] And then let's talk about the last one is maximizing your local search and online reviews.

[00:19:26] This is a no-brainer, but it's so impactful.

[00:19:31] This is one of those things that it doesn't feel great to you as the business owner or the orthodontist because it's really out of your hands for the most part.

[00:19:40] And I say that with my tongue in cheek, right?

[00:19:42] And the idea is because search engine optimization, SEO, that type of stuff you need help with typically.

[00:19:49] And so that's when you and your marketing partner can kind of work on that together.

[00:19:54] That takes time to build up.

[00:19:56] To me, it's less sexy, less exciting.

[00:19:59] But your Google reviews, your online reviews, your Yelp reviews, those are things that you can directly kind of push or ask for in your office.

[00:20:12] And it really, really, really helps.

[00:20:14] I promise that is probably the number one thing that you should strive for as a startup or an early practice.

[00:20:21] Or even if you haven't been doing it, you should dedicate resources to getting good, strong five-star reviews over and over.

[00:20:29] The more you have, the more legit you look.

[00:20:33] So you are going to just shine above the others.

[00:20:36] If you have a patient that is just singing your praises when they're in your office, don't be afraid to ask.

[00:20:43] What's the worst they're going to do?

[00:20:45] No.

[00:20:46] Say, no, I don't have time.

[00:20:47] That, okay.

[00:20:49] But if you get them to do it, man, that's worth its weight in gold.

[00:20:53] We talk about it almost every single week as a team.

[00:20:56] And we say, hey, if we have those patients that are so excited, just ask them right then, you know, hey, will you be willing to give us a strong review?

[00:21:05] Because we really want more people to be able to experience what you've experienced.

[00:21:10] Just saying it in those terms really, really helps.

[00:21:13] And I mean, listen, I love my patients.

[00:21:15] I love my patient population.

[00:21:16] I think it's great.

[00:21:17] But we're busy.

[00:21:18] Everybody's busy.

[00:21:19] So if you don't catch them right then or ask them right then or make it convenient for them to easily make a review, sometimes life happens and they forget.

[00:21:28] So make it easy for them.

[00:21:31] Ask them to do it.

[00:21:33] And then, you know, sit back and watch your reviews grow and then watch your practice blossom.

[00:21:38] It's awesome.

[00:21:39] That is amazing.

[00:21:42] So many golden nuggets in this episode.

[00:21:45] Hope everyone has enjoyed it.

[00:21:47] If you have a question that you want us to answer and dive deep on in this podcast, let us know.

[00:21:52] And we'll see you next time.

[00:21:54] It's my big, guys.

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